"Official" Thread The Political / Election Quotes, Video, and Meme Thread!

FrankenGlock said:
Do you agree or disagree with the state passing laws that protect you having a gun in your car while at work? Most employers do not want you to have your gun anywhere on their property but many states have laws that protect your right to have the gun in your car even on others property.
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Actually no. I believe in the autonomy of private property owners to set their own rules and policies (even if I disagree). Though, those rules or policies have no legal weight.

Similarly the gov't should have no say in what speech is allowed or not allowed on private property.
 
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The plant I worked at used to allow firearms in your car. My state has the longest deer hunting season in the country. Lots of the night shift guys would hit the deer stand after work and kept their deer rifle in the truck.

Then they were bought out by THE chemical company. No more guns in your car. They would bring in sniffer dogs periodically to check the parking lot. Security used to joke that the dog would alert on my vehicle, but it never did. Oh, and with the old company, security personnel had to be armed. An insurance requirement they said.
New policy had them donate all the guns to the Sherrif's Office. Security's guns were now an insurance liability they said. 🙄
 
Maybe it would be a deterrent if they stay and create incentive to leave?

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Racer88 said:
Actually no. I believe in the autonomy of private property owners to set their own rules and policies (even if I disagree). Similarly the gov't should have no say in what speech is allowed or not allowed on private property.
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Wish that were the case, but the government is highly involved with private property rights, and all states require you to rent your own property from them via property tax. However, looks like Desantis is getting a watered-down version of what he wanted pushed through to limit property taxes. Guess better something than nothing.
 
FrankenGlock said:
Wish that were the case, but the government is highly involved with private property rights, and all states require you to rent your own property from them via property tax. However, looks like Desantis is getting a watered-down version of what he wanted pushed through to limit property taxes. Guess better something than nothing.
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Red Herring... not even close to what we're talking about.
 
Racer88 said:
The referenced firing was a fire-fighter, which is a gov't job.

In the private sector, constitutional protections do not apply.
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I would venture that State and Federal Labor Laws will still apply. (ie: no "discrimination" based on blahblahblah)

FrankenGlock said:
Do you agree or disagree with the state passing laws that protect you having a gun in your car while at work? Most employers do not want you to have your gun anywhere on their property but many states have laws that protect your right to have the gun in your car even on others property.
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Racer88 said:
Actually no. I believe in the autonomy of private property owners to set their own rules and policies (even if I disagree). Though, those rules or policies have no legal weight.
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no4mk1t said:
The plant I worked at used to allow firearms in your car. My state has the longest deer hunting season in the country. Lots of the night shift guys would hit the deer stand after work and kept their deer rifle in the truck.
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Many businesses have financing of some sort which likely involves insuring of assets. So now you have two entities "in the background" (banks and insurance cos.) determining the business' public/customer/employee policy. If some lib nerd on the BOD of the ins. co. thinks guns in cars are a "liability" because maybe 1 in 10,000 auto thefts might involve a gun(s) stolen, (a SWAG), then EVERYONE has to abide or you find another ins. co. that will allow it but probably doesn't exist... :(
 
Bobster said:
I would venture that State and Federal Labor Laws will still apply. (ie: no "discrimination" based on blahblahblah)
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Federal Labor Laws aren't in the Bill of Rights. I'm talking about Constitutional protections as it pertains to the BoR. They do not apply to private entities. That's a simple fact.

Bobster said:
If some lib nerd on the BOD of the ins. co. thinks guns in cars are a "liability" because maybe 1 in 10,000 auto thefts might involve a gun(s) stolen, (a SWAG), then EVERYONE has to abide or you find another ins. co. that will allow it but probably doesn't exist... :(
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I have a business. I have business property and liability insurance. There is NOTHING in the policy about whether I can allow guns on the property. I believe this is a bullshit argument. It simply doesn't exist. Please show me an example of a property insurance policy that stipulates this.
 
Racer88 said:
Federal Labor Laws aren't in the Bill of Rights. I'm talking about Constitutional protections as it pertains to the BoR. They do not apply to private entities. That's a simple fact.
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The fact that the BoR does not apply to businesses is EXACTLY why I support states passing laws that stop employers from trampling on our rights. I should not be required by my employer to support causes I am personally and religiously opposed to. I have left jobs due to this. But not everyone is in a situation where they can quit a job like that. No one should be forced to wear gay pride garb, lie about someone's gender or march at a rally just to keep their job. Employers who do that kind of crap should be stopped from enforcing such rules. The gov't shall pass no law restricting the exercise free speech, but it should help protect free speech from those who would quash it under the other types of authority.
 
Warhammer said:
The fact that the BoR does not apply to businesses is EXACTLY why I support states passing laws that stop employers from trampling on our rights.
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You don't have Constitutional Rights protections when on another private entity's property. Period. The end.

A private employer can "trample" all over your Right to Free Speech, because that Right does not have Constitutional protections on THEIR PROPERTY... or under THEIR EMPLOY.

It's really QUITE PERFECT as it (the Constitution) is written and enforced WHEN APPLICABLE. It's not applicable if you're working for me or in my house. Don't like my policies or rules? There's the door. You don't have to work for me or visit my home. You have no right to either a job in my company or as a guest.

Again... the Constitution is a document that SOLELY prescribes what the GOVERNMENT can and cannot do. It's got fuck-all to do with private entities.

What you're describing and suggesting is EXACTLY what Biden's administration did when coercing Facebook (a private entity) to censor posts about covid and the covid shots. I am adamantly against it and pledged my life in military service to defend against exactly that kind of attack on our Constitutional Rights.
 
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Racer88 said:
You don't have Constitutional Rights protections when on another private entity's property. Period. The end.

A private employer can "trample" all over your Right to Free Speech, because that Right does not have Constitutional protections on THEIR PROPERTY... or under THEIR EMPLOY.

It's really QUITE PERFECT as it (the Constitution) is written and enforced WHEN APPLICABLE. It's not applicable if you're working for me or in my house. Don't like my policies or rules? There's the door. You don't have to work for me or visit my home. You have no right to either a job in my company or as a guest.

Again... the Constitution is a document that SOLELY prescribes what the GOVERNMENT can and cannot do. It's got fuck-all to do with private entities.
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I agree. But there are laws which regulate behaviors outside of Constitutional protections, are the not? The Constitution is not the only written law in the land.
 
Warhammer said:
I agree. But there are laws which regulate behaviors outside of Constitutional protections, are the not? The Constitution is not the only written law in the land.
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It is the only law in the land that pertains to restrictions and permissions for the US gov't.

Yes, there are labor laws and all kinds of other laws.

But what you are advocating crosses / blurs the lines between laws governing the public and laws governing what the gov't can do.
 
Racer88 said:
It is the only law in the land that pertains to restrictions and permissions for the US gov't.

Yes, there are labor laws and all kinds of other laws.

But what you are advocating crosses / blurs the lines between laws governing the public and laws governing what the gov't can do.
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I fully understand that the constitution (originally) only restricts the US Government's actions. I'm not arguing that. Goverments (federal, state and local) pass laws that restrict or require certain behaviors from businesses all the time. From workplace safety to anti-discrimination laws, there are tons of them. You can't pretend that there are no laws in existence other than the Constitution.
 
Warhammer said:
I fully understand that the constitution (originally) only restricts the US Government's actions. I'm not arguing that. Goverments (federal, state and local) pass laws that restrict or require certain behaviors from businesses all the time. From workplace safety to anti-discrimination laws, there are tons of them. You can't pretend that there are no laws in existence other than the Constitution.
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Yes. But you're conflating labor laws with the Bill of Rights. Two entirely different things. When you start insisting that the BoR be enforced upon private entities, that's crossing a HUGE line.
 
Racer88 said:
Federal Labor Laws aren't in the Bill of Rights. I'm talking about Constitutional protections as it pertains to the BoR. They do not apply to private entities. That's a simple fact.
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Quoting the Constitution is not going to get the firefighter his job back... :rolleyes: ;) Is the infraction outlined and penalty stipulated in the employment contract? It is? But the firing was a violation of the Bill of Rights? :eek: Sorry, that's too bad. :( You better have at LEAST a million dollars and several years to see your case through all of the lower courts up to the Supremes. :unsure: And you still might not get your job back... :D
Racer88 said:
I have a business. I have business property and liability insurance. There is NOTHING in the policy about whether I can allow guns on the property. I believe this is a bullshit argument. It simply doesn't exist. Please show me an example of a property insurance policy that stipulates this.
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I'm talking liability insurance and companies lowering their "risk" by specifically forbidding employees to be armed or have arms in their cars.

A while back, I was thinking of getting a FFL at my shop which is zoned Commercial. The yearly difference in the liability policy was $1200 more a year to be a gun dealer. So that is having to make an extra $100/month just to cover insurance costs.
 
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